Obviously you guys have a big issue here and I'm here to help you solved it. I seriously think you guys should move to a Canadian Server. It makes soo sense. Besides you can finally be as cool as Spencer, if you do. :)
I just wanted to keep this discussion in the back of our minds as the rest of our raiders continue to level. Perenolde looks like it's seeing a short-term boost in population, but I'm betting it will die off again quickly. I think a few people are still unsure about the idea of transferring due to the number of characters they have--bear in mind this doesn't have to be all of your characters. You can successfully play in two different servers if you wish, as long as you don't mind losing the ability to transfer items / gold between your toons. Jordan's an example of someone I know who has successful toons on two different servers. Again, I'm happy with whatever the guild decides to do.
For those that would like to xfer, I'd like to suggest that we narrow the list to 3 different realms. A lot of people have been looking around to see our option, and we can think about how to narrow the list. I suggest that we look mainly for a higher-population, friendly, but active community that's in the right time zones we're looking for. Once we think we've found that, then we can sort out if we want to refine our options from there.
We can get a feel for each realm by: --checking them out on WarcraftRealms.com for the overall population ratio --looking at the server on WoWWiki to see if it has overall information --looking at WoWProgress to see the progression rate of the active guilds (which gives us an idea for how much activity we can expect to see on the server in general) --checking out their server forums --creating a character and listening in on gchat and trade chat in a main city
These things will tell us more about the community we're choosing.
Food for thought--we're going to want to decide in the next few weeks so people have time to xfer their toons. Also, I looked up the FAQ's for guild xfers, and I just thought people might want to take a look through to see how it works:
Hey everyone, So far I'm rather irritated on our progression and a lack caring about progressing. Tanks not coming preppared with strats and enchants/gems on gear. People are too worried about achivments then progression. This guild is supposed to be a raid "progression" guild but so far it is pretty fail. Im not gonna sit around on a dead server just to raid "maybe" 2 times a week. I do PVP and PVE because I enjoy all aspects of the game, but its hard to do on this server. Shit don't start to turn around this coming week, I will most likely jump ship off this server.
This tier, progression fell a couple of weeks behind due to waiting for people to be geared and RL commitments from our core raiders. However, that being said, we've done reasonably well considering we only raid 2 nights a week (and the lack of overall raid time is largely due to the very limited times when we are all able to meet). We've had more consistency in our raid times and attendance than Jordan's 'hardcore' raiding guild on Saurfang. We've raided twice a week consistently since our raids started.
I agree that people should be better prepared and making sure that they are gemmed/enchanted etc and that everyone should be familiar with the main mechanics before we approach a fight.
However, I don't think the tone of your statement is really helping anything. I think you'll find people don't respond well to negative coercion like 'I'm gonna jump ship.' What they do respond to is 'I think we're not progressing at the rate that we could be; let's make sure we're all 100% ready to go before raid so that we're not letting the other raiders down.' We're all adults here; there's no need to speak to friends and guild members like we're your latest adopted bunch of failures that you merely tolerate.
im of the mind that after the holidays real life commititments will settle down and we can all get into our schedules and make the raids as needed i dont think people are blowing off raid for other things. i think that we r still as good as we were in cataclysm i just dont think things started out at optimal. that being said....the group concensus was...we want to raid with friends and have fun also in that same statement was while we r raiding we want to push it
so i have a solution..very ez fix..relax a bit enjoy the time spent with friends raiding secondly and this includes me as well as everybody else in a blanket statement lets show our commitment to the raid"i.e. each other" by showing up rdy to roll some bosses..gems chants stats and..attitudes where they need to be for us to be the best raid possible. we r friends and guildies we play with each other for the social aspect of spending time with friends lets not snipe at each other and play the blame game..if one of us fails we all fail..i like win and lots of it so LET"S DO EET!!!!!!!!!
Ugh, I think we were doing well....but I deffinetely read that comment entirely wrong. I took it very personally. I agree with Naj, I feel like we have been consistantly raiding 2x per week which is what we decided on before xpac came out.
With that said....anyone able or have comments about raiding thursday/friday this week instead of thursday saturday?
I'm sorry, but Jordan and I really can't do Friday--it's literally the only night we have where no raids are on. I'm rapidly losing my sanity to how little time he and I spend together. We're still totally fine to do Thursday and Saturday as per normal.
Naj, I'm just kind of chiming in as someone that doesn't raid and isn't around for the vent chats. So maybe I can bring an outsider's point of view.
I just read this thread and was left wondering if there's a clear sense about what level of progression is actually expected.
What sharptusk pointed out was a behavior that I would consider pure negligence. Showing up without basic gems/enchants etc is more than a stone's throw from the problems being mentioned with people having scheduling issues, like real life conflicts or whatever.
I suppose what I'm wondering is where the line in the sand is here. what's really being discussed? Is it that there's not enough of a recruitment pool on the server? that the people that you DO have aren't prepared to take progression seriously? That Naj is too nice? That you're not on the high global rankings for guild progressions? That not enough blood elf priests?
It feels to me like there's a few different problems being discussed, and "Should we stay or go" is being presented as the solution to that rather loosely defined problem.
Would maybe be good to figure out what the problem is. Although you guys likely know a bunch of things I don't know, I don't think they're outlined clearly in this thread.
My quick observation is that right now we seem to be in farm mode with not much progress. And I'm not pointing fingers at any one person because there have been lots of people who have missed raid times for various reasons. When you only raid 2 nights a week for 3 hours and then can't make those times for anything short of a dire emergency / major life event I think it reveals a lack of prioritizing. So in that respect I think it's fair to say we aren't really a progression raid at this point and time. And in that respect I can support Mark's post although the tone was a bit harsh. Anyway I gotta go to work now. Cheers.
Yep, fair enough point Jeff. A lot of people have RL stuff going on that's taken priority over raids. So it's true, at this point we're not really a progression-orientated raid. I think we could be (and at some point we had all decided we wanted to be), but priorities do seem to have shifted with everyone's busy RL schedules. My post was just saying that we have raided 2 nights a week every week since we started and, in general, I think we've had very few cancellations / fillers needed. Logs show our usual 10 people online for every raid with only two exceptions to that rule (moosby filling in one day last week and emo filling in this week). Last week Jordan and I had to go to his Mom's performance, but we shifted to raiding on Friday instead. So, we still raided two nights. One of the nights I was very late due to my horrible misjudgement in the daylight savings time swap, so I take full ownership for that dumb mistake.
Maybe I'm comparing too much to Jordan's 'hardcore' progression guild, who have had so many regular cancellations / leaving / dire emergencies / gf aggros / etc that they regularly have to extend raids by hours and add on extra raiding days to make up for the lack of consistent, reliable raiders. It seems to be a growing trend in WoW in general. Priorities are shifting away from WoW and more toward RL stuff. Jordan's been trying to run his guild with 12-13 raiders, but even his raids have sometimes been sitting around waiting hours for their 10th to log online. He's gone through half of his raid members in the short time they've been raiding this expansion pack.
That being said, I fully agree with what Lune said before:
"relax a bit enjoy the time spent with friends raiding secondly and this includes me as well as everybody else in a blanket statement lets show our commitment to the raid"i.e. each other" by showing up rdy to roll some bosses..gems chants stats and..attitudes where they need to be for us to be the best raid possible."
Where I'm coming from I just see a trend that I would like to stop if at all possible. For the last three nights it's been one after another oh I can't be here next time coming from different directions. Then people are late, internets act up etc. We have basically no flexibility in our schedule so I just want people to realize if this is going to work they really should make every effort to be there. Bringing in subs for progression fights has some small value, but we need our whole team there ready to rock if we're going to have any shot at progressing in the miniscule amount of time we raid.
I think Salv raises a really good point in that the problem needs to be defined. Personally...i feel like there is a difference in how people prioritize our raids. Yes we have raided 2 nights a week since we started raiding...but from my perspective at least something has come up pretty consistently every week. lateness, internet (me i know), not geared/gemmed properly, RL coming up. When any of these issues arise...sure we can accomodate...but the raid feels less fun and more tense, which defeats the purpose. For sure..i dont think WoW is more important than anyones real life, but its still a commitment we've made to the 9 other people to be here each week.
Lets get back to our consistent two nights a week...so we can continue making funny nicknames for eachother, reading the forced confessions from naj, and killing bosses. If nothing else lets respect eachother and our time. If you need help with a few things because you didnt have time that week...ask. We are friends and are here for eachother.
Hey guys, Just thought id throw this out there as a question. Im having a really tough time being able to raid on saturday nights. I can make it work obviously but im not getting much time with my little brother and makes my weekends very limited. Hell id raid 4 nights a week if we could but saturday is really hurting me. I know we just decided this 6 weeks ago but im just wondering if there are any solutions out there?
Keep in mind this not a message saying im quitting raid if we dont change the day.
Yeah, I can understand that feeling all too well. Jordan and I have very limited weekend and evening activities as well, which is why I'm quite stubborn about keeping Friday (well your Friday) free of raiding. The trick we run into is finding another day that doesn't clash with Jordan's raid and doesn't make others stay up too late.
The nights that are feasible for Jordan and I to raid (at least during the winter months before you guys go back to daylight savings) are:
Monday nights -- 9-11.30 ST Tuesday nights --9-11.30 ST Wednesday nights -- 9-11.30ST Thursday nights -- any time after 9ST Saturday nights -- any time before 12 ST